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Episode #


The Benefits of Sponsoring RISE and the Underground Economy: A Conversation with Miranda Bruce and Steve Santorelli

Show Notes

In this week's episode of the Future of Cyber Risk podcast, David speaks to Miranda Bruce, Postdoctoral Fellow at the University of Oxford, and Steve Santorelli, Chief of Staff at Team Cymru, about the RISE and Underground Economy conferences. A RISE scholarship recipient, Miranda talks about her experience attending the Underground Economy conference, the value of meeting individuals in the industry, and how it helped further her research. Together, they discuss the benefits the conference provides for the security community, and why organizations should consider sponsoring the conference to increase security knowledge and practice worldwide.

Topics discussed:

  • What the RISE and Underground Economy conferences are and how they were created to bridge the gap between law enforcement and industry.

  • How Team Cymru hand-picks the conference audiences to be a mix of security and cybercrime specialists from different industries, ensuring that law enforcement plays a major role.

  • Miranda's experience in receiving a RISE scholarship, and her story about attending the Underground Economy conference.

  • Miranda’s advice for RISE or UE attendees on which sessions to go to (all of them!), how it can expose attendees to new ideas, and the importance of connecting and networking between sessions or at social events.

  • The vision for the future of RISE and UE, and where in the world the conferences will be held next.

  • Why organizations should sponsor individuals to go to the conferences, and how they'll create value through face-to-face interactions and knowledge acquisition.

  • How RISE and UE expose attendees to new ideas, and how Miranda was able to further her research by meeting and interviewing security professionals.

To learn more about the conferences, visit or contact

Quotes from Episode


"Underground Economy was just really great for me and it's great for anybody. Even if you don't have an academic interest in cybercrime, it teaches you new things, it gets you in touch with new people, and it gives you a new way of thinking about this area and thinking about how cybercrime is becoming more complex and also how it's becoming more simple in some ways." (Miranda: 51:05-51:28)


"Underground Economy — favorite event of the year. And the reason that it's so great is because you get to really learn new things and you also get to back up thoughts that you already had." (Miranda: 50:17)


"There was this massive chasm between industry and law enforcement. There really was no discussion going on. ... So we originally came up with the Underground Economy Conference with the intention of trying to put a bridge over that chasm and just get folks talking." (Steve: 7:04)


"The biggest thing about attending Underground Economy and sponsoring people to go is, it creates an enormous amount of value. The kinds of connections that are made, they might not directly or immediately add value to your own organization or your own interests or goals, but it contributes to the general richness of the community and how it all works together." (Miranda: 40:57)

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